Generation Terrorists » Forum
Sign up   |   Start new thread   |   Lost password?   |   Edit profile   |   Member List   |   myGT   |   Blog
Keyword
From
To
 

Cool ! this is only 20 minutes from where I live
ifihadahif Posted: Tue Jun 21 11:16:51 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
 
http://www.knobcreekshoot.com/


 
addi Posted: Tue Jun 21 11:34:15 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Nifty!

Wish i could get away from work...my kinda folk will be gathered there!

: )

*you knew you'd get a response from me on this one, didn't you.






 
ifihadahif Posted: Tue Jun 21 12:57:29 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Forgot to add that it's just about 10 minutes down the road from a bourbon distillery.
HA !



 
Posted: Tue Jun 21 13:31:03 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  heh
cool man. that looks pretty wickedsweet


 
FN Posted: Tue Jun 21 14:35:54 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Haha

Is it for real or a spoof?


 
cookies&cream Posted: Tue Jun 21 14:51:50 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Christophe said:
>Haha
>
>Is it for real or a spoof?

spoof? naw, people actually do these things. there's an annual gun thingy out here where the guys take their guns & clay pigeons/whatever else they wanna shoot, & the food & drinks are free. it's a BYOB kinda thing tho. they don't support drinking & handling guns.


 
Mesh Posted: Tue Jun 21 14:56:40 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I wish I could go. Will you be attending, hifmeister?


 
ifihadahif Posted: Tue Jun 21 15:51:35 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  meshuggah said:
>I wish I could go. Will you be attending, hifmeister?
>
Nah, but a I know a few folks that go every year. It's a pretty big event here.
Definitely not a spoof.
They say it's a real rush getting to shoot a 50cal full auto mutherfucker.


 
DanSRose Posted: Tue Jun 21 18:26:27 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I think I'll be Mr. StormCloud, but that creeped the fuck out of me.
That picture:
http://www.knobcreekshoot.com/images/main2/Gallery2-14.html

And this one
http://www.knobcreekshoot.com/images/main/Gallery1-10.html

And really all of it in general. Yeah, still creeping me out.


 
Silentmind Posted: Wed Jun 22 00:52:12 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  That is...disturbing. Very, very, disturbing.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 07:08:13 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Silentmind said:
>That is...disturbing. Very, very, disturbing.
>
Why would you find this disturbing ?

I can understand why you or anyone might not like this stuff, but why disturbing ?


 
DanSRose Posted: Wed Jun 22 12:40:16 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Because of the level they're taking pleasure in using the weapons. The weapons are purposely designed killing instruments, honed for accuracy and deadliness, and they are taking pleasure in them, no matter the use they say they are using them for.
It's not comforting to see.


 
Beep Posted: Wed Jun 22 12:51:25 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Guns are not cool. Anything designed with the one use of hurt cannot be a good thing. no matter what you say there's a way around any problem, any situation, any war apart from bloodshed.
violence is just the easy way out when people cannot take the cost/be bothered to sort things in a good way.
if less money was spent on guns, and more money was put into productive things then we would be in a much better off world.
and that goes for individuals as well as countries.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 14:37:45 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  So I can safely assume that you would be equally disturbed if instead of guns, they were using bows and arrows ?
What about karate tournaments, do they disturb you ?



 
Ed Posted: Wed Jun 22 14:51:42 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>So I can safely assume that you would be equally disturbed if instead of guns, they were using bows and arrows ?

If the arrows had crazy tips that were designed to do unnecessary amounts of damage, yeah.

>What about karate tournaments, do they disturb you ?
What's that got to do with weapons?


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 15:24:14 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Ed said:
>ifihadahif said:
>>So I can safely assume that you would be equally disturbed if instead of guns, they were using bows and arrows ?
>
>If the arrows had crazy tips that were designed to do unnecessary amounts of damage, yeah.
>
>>What about karate tournaments, do they disturb you ?
>What's that got to do with weapons?
>
I was responding to Dan and Beeps' post about things designed only for killing.
How do you think karate was invented ?
It was brought about because of an oppressive government that refused to allow the people to possess weapons of their own, so they invented karate (oversimplification but accurate), and the weapons of karate, scias, nunchucks, and the bo, are evolved from farm equipment, designed only for killing and self defense.


 
addi Posted: Wed Jun 22 15:57:03 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I like guns in the hands of our military and police forces.

I dislike guns in any one else's hands.
I dislike any event that celebrates their ability to kill in mass.

Guns are innate objects designed soley for being efficient killing machines. Humans are emotional creatures. Too often that makes for a tragic event when the two are put together.

of course my opinion on this surprises no one : )


 
FN Posted: Wed Jun 22 16:06:13 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I like guns.

I dislike extremes.

That's all I have to say about this.


 
Mesh Posted: Wed Jun 22 16:12:09 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Christophe said:
>I like guns.
>
>I dislike extremes.
>
>That's all I have to say about this.


And I'll have to agree with this.


 
addi Posted: Wed Jun 22 16:36:46 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Christophe said:
>I like guns.


but do they like you?


>I dislike extremes.

therein lies the problem my studly Belgian son. How do you keep the guns out of the hands of those extremeists?
I grew up with guns used for hunting. But it's impossible to keep those things out of the hands of the loonies here. And to further excaserbate (always wanted to use that word in a sentence) the problem we make the kind of guns at that event in Kentucky available to average joe blow here. So Mr. Wacko can mow down 30 people in a minute now instead of just a couple.
Game hunters don't need those kinds of guns to shoot deer, or sheepies, or birds...people who want to kill other people use them.

It just boils down to the fact that I trust about 90% of Americans with a gun as being sane, safely conscious, law abiding gun owners (hif included).
And the remaining 10%, while a much smaller percentage, still leaves a few million unstable nutcases out there with access to very dangerous instant killing machines. Not one single night goes by here in the U.S. when you turn on your local news and don't hear about another shooting and murder happening somewhere.
It's just not worth it to me.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 16:40:41 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  There are no statistics that prove gun control to be effective.


 
FN Posted: Wed Jun 22 16:58:55 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Without getting into a debate about gun control being effective or not, I wonder hif (not a rethorical question but I really wonder): how do you coïncide the paranoia towards terrorism getting weapons and being able to do some damage, and the fact that guns of any kind are freely available in the US.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 17:46:58 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Christophe said:
>Without getting into a debate about gun control being effective or not, I wonder hif (not a rethorical question but I really wonder): how do you coïncide the paranoia towards terrorism getting weapons and being able to do some damage, and the fact that guns of any kind are freely available in the US.
>
What makes you think that guns of any kind are freely available in the US ?


 
addi Posted: Wed Jun 22 17:54:02 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>There are no statistics that prove gun control to be effective.

and there won't be in the U.S. either because we have never in our history had any period where there was any meaningful gun control...so doing research here to see if it's effective is kinda impossible, eh?
And don't give me any studies done in other countries please. They're meaningless here. Every culture is different (even those Canadians next to us), so trying to apply any findings done on some other culture is worthless outside of that country.

Here's my idea:
Take away every person's gun(s) for one full year here and see what results you come up with. If there were no significant statistical drop in violent murders then the government could hand them all back..maybe even pass a gun out to every family for being nice and cooperating with the experiment.

If it was however determined that gun control was significantly effective in lessening the number of murders here the government would get to keep all the guns forever, and for good measure give every member of the NRA a wedgie.
Doesn't that sound fair?


 
Mesh Posted: Wed Jun 22 17:55:02 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I have a new avatar in honor of this thread.


 
addi Posted: Wed Jun 22 17:56:41 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:

>What makes you think that guns of any kind are freely available in the US ?

Please don't make me respond to this hif. Be fair here in your arguements.
thanks


 
FN Posted: Wed Jun 22 18:18:50 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Prior to 2004 even stinger missiles were legal to have in private possession. I don't know if they still are.

Also, you can get military grade weapons, including full and semi-automatic and assault weaponry.

Or am I wrong? And are all those people going to that event just borrowing those weapons or what?

I doubt that the government just offered 3 gatling guns to be fused as one. My guess is that the guy who made that owns them.

Do you have any idea about what a terrorist could cause with 1 gatling gun?


 
FN Posted: Wed Jun 22 18:20:32 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>What makes you think that guns of any kind are freely available in the US ?

The fact that a bank (sic) can give away weapons to anybody opening an account if they just say that they're not insane, to me shows that yeah, anybody can get a weapon.

Even with just a hunting rifle a "terrorists" could wreak some havoc, or don't you agree.


 
addi Posted: Wed Jun 22 18:36:10 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I could get a gun here (any kind of gun) very easily.
If I chose to be legal about it all i need to do is get my gun license at my county office, sign a statement that I'm not a felon, not convicted of domestic abuse, haven't been in a mental institution over the past 5 years (six years ago being crazy is fine though), and haven't been convicted of dealing drugs.
I could go to any place that sells guns and choose from literally hundreds of guns to buy.

but get this...


Georgia does not regulate gun shows. Pursuant to Ga. Code § 16-11-184(b)(1), no county or municipal corporation, by zoning or by ordinance, resolution, or other enactment, shall regulate gun shows in any manner.

In addition, Georgia does not require private sellers to perform background checks on potential firearms purchasers at gun shows. According to the Americans for Gun Safety analysis The Iron Pipeline: Georgia is Nation’s Second Leading Gun Trafficking State, Georgia is a prominent source of illegal firearms, many originating from sales at gun shows.

So if I wanted to bust a cap in some asshole and didn't want the hassle of being legal i could go to a gun show here and pick me up a kick ass assault rifle without the worry of a background check...cool!

and if I was really in a hurry i know the neighborhood i could drive to in 20 minutes from my home. At first they'd run out to my car hoping i would buy drugs, but if i flashed the money i have no doubt i could drive away with a handgun.

In America you can get a gun very easily.


 
kurohyou Posted: Wed Jun 22 18:47:59 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I was always interested by that gun Bruce Willis uses in the Jackal. The computerized one with the remote. Now that thing could cause some damage.

Just found out that if my brother gets hired with the Sheriff's dept he's applied with he'll be issued an AR-15 assualt rifle to carry in the trunk of his cruiser. But that's for law enforcement.

For what it's worth...


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 19:28:36 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Christophe said:
>Prior to 2004 even stinger missiles were legal to have in private possession. I don't know if they still are.
>
Where did you hear that crap ?

>Also, you can get military grade weapons, including full and semi-automatic and assault weaponry.
>
Yes, you can get them, but you can get them anywhere on the planet.
Just like any drug you want is obtainable. Doesn't mean they are legal.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 19:30:17 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Beep said:
>Guns are not cool. Anything designed with the one use of hurt cannot be a good thing. no matter what you say there's a way around any problem, any situation, any war apart from bloodshed.
>violence is just the easy way out when people cannot take the cost/be bothered to sort things in a good way.
>
who gets to decide what is the "good way"?

>if less money was spent on guns, and more money was put into productive things then we would be in a much better off world.
>
Right and who decides what is productive and what is not ?


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 19:36:38 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  addi said:
>ifihadahif said:
>>There are no statistics that prove gun control to be effective.
>
>and there won't be in the U.S. either because we have never in our history had any period where there was any meaningful gun control...so doing research here to see if it's effective is kinda impossible, eh?
>And don't give me any studies done in other countries please. They're meaningless here. Every culture is different (even those Canadians next to us), so trying to apply any findings done on some other culture is worthless outside of that country.
>
Try this out - it doesn't matter what the culture is, it has never worked in any culture period. What makes you think it would work here ?
What makes our culture so unique that something that has never worked anywhere on the planet would work here ?
And I disagree with you about the Canadian culture being so different from ours.
Our culture is different enough by regions that Canada could just be another region in North America.
The culture where you live is certainly different than where Libra lives and definitely different from where you lived in Nebraska but we are also alike in many ways. Canada is very much like that to us.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 19:38:20 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  addi said:
>ifihadahif said:
>
>>What makes you think that guns of any kind are freely available in the US ?
>
>Please don't make me respond to this hif. Be fair here in your arguements.
>thanks
>
I would like a fair response to this because your being unfair now.



 
FN Posted: Wed Jun 22 19:38:34 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>Christophe said:
>>Prior to 2004 even stinger missiles were legal to have in private possession. I don't know if they still are.
>>
>Where did you hear that crap ?

Where did you hear otherwise.

>Yes, you can get them, but you can get them anywhere on the planet.

Sure, I'm sure I could find a pink elephant if I searched hard enough for it too, but that's not the point. The point is control by the government and access to guns.

>Just like any drug you want is obtainable. Doesn't mean they are legal.

If that is your point hif, then all drugs should be legalised too, I wonder how many of your Republican buddies would like that.

Hey, and lets cancel taxes too, because no matter how much control you put on them, people will still find ways to dodge them anyways.

And what about police? People will still commit crimes anyway.



I can see what you're trying to defend here hif, but again, you only use it to your advantage and don't seem to consider the implications when the same arguement could be turned against you.


 
FN Posted: Wed Jun 22 19:41:18 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>Our culture is different enough by regions that Canada could just be another region in North America.

The whole Western world is more or less alike, yet I don't think that you could get around the fact that there are in fact big differences.

Some american extremes could simply not happen over here, and that goes both ways probably. This thread alone is a clear example.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 19:46:44 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Christophe said:
>ifihadahif said:
>>Christophe said:
>>>Prior to 2004 even stinger missiles were legal to have in private possession. I don't know if they still are.
>>>
>>Where did you hear that crap ?
>
>Where did you hear otherwise.
>
>>Yes, you can get them, but you can get them anywhere on the planet.
>
>Sure, I'm sure I could find a pink elephant if I searched hard enough for it too, but that's not the point. The point is control by the government and access to guns.
>
>>Just like any drug you want is obtainable. Doesn't mean they are legal.
>
>If that is your point hif, then all drugs should be legalised too, I wonder how many of your Republican buddies would like that.
>
>Hey, and lets cancel taxes too, because no matter how much control you put on them, people will still find ways to dodge them anyways.
>
>And what about police? People will still commit crimes anyway.
>
>
>
>I can see what you're trying to defend here hif, but again, you only use it to your advantage and don't seem to consider the implications when the same arguement could be turned against you.
>
My point is that full auto weapons are illegal to own without a license and stinger missiles have never been legal to own.
To get licensed for full auto weapons, you have to go through a very thorough background check and you also have to sign away your civil rights.
That means that if you own a full auto weapon, the authorities can enter your home anytime they want without probable cause or a warrant.
Also full auto weapons are not used to commit crimes here. Check the stats on that.

You might also check these stats:

CRIME RATES LOWER IN STATES THAT ALLOW LAW-ABIDING CITIZENS TO CARRY FIREARMS
States with favorable concealed carry laws have lower rates of crime than states with restrictive concealed carry laws. Overall, the homicide rate for states with favorable carry laws is 31% lower, and the robbery rate is 36% lower, than for states with restrictive concealed carry laws. States which have recently changed their laws have experienced reductions in homicide rates. Since 1987, when Florida enacted a favorable CCW law, its homicide rate has dropped 22%, even while the national rate has risen 15%. Only .007% of Florida CCW permits have been revoked because of a crime after licensure.


 
FN Posted: Wed Jun 22 19:55:41 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>My point is that full auto weapons are illegal to own without a license and stinger missiles have never been legal to own.

A quick search for stinger missile ban -bee on google:

LaPierre said that the gun ban was purely cosmetic.

That's total baloney. It's a right-wing talking point lie.

Is a Flash Suppressor cosmetic?
How about a 30 round vs. 10 round magazine?
How about a telescopic stock?
Or a bayonet?
Or a grenade launcher?

A flash suppressor would make it harder to spot a sniper.
A 30 round magazine would allow a homicidal maniac to shoot 30 people before he has to pause to reload.
A telescoping stock would help a terrorist hide an assault rifle in a baggy coat.
A bayonet could kill people trying to tackle a criminal.
A grenade launcher? That's too obvious.

So what's the limit to the right to bear arms according to Wayne LaPierre? Well, he ducked that question. I guess a bazooka, stinger missile, and other weapons of massive destruction are perfectly legit for the NRA.

Posted by: jspark at September 13, 2004 04:00 PM


http://www.newshounds.us/2004/09/13/assaulting_the_ban.php

I don't know if any laws have been passed to ban stingers.

Agreed, buying one could be hard, but hey, you could get one, right hif?

And you can own whatever weapon you want, having the right to bear arms. No?

>To get licensed for full auto weapons, you have to go through a very thorough background check and you also have to sign away your civil rights.

Why still have this. You can get anything you want anyway.

>Also full auto weapons are not used to commit crimes here. Check the stats on that.

>You might also check these stats

The discussion is not about the average citizen. I'm talking about terrorists legally owning and carrying weapons untill they decide to act on it.


 
DanSRose Posted: Wed Jun 22 21:53:48 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>CRIME RATES LOWER IN STATES THAT ALLOW LAW-ABIDING CITIZENS TO CARRY FIREARMS

That's ignoring allllll the other factors, including that many of those states have small populations with what I'd call "silly cities", meaning those without a heterogenous population of mixed cultures, religions, etc. and those with small densities of their populations.
Crime rates are a tricky thing to measure especially in cities, where crime rates are higher and there are all those things that we associate high crime, like being poor.
But whatever. Georgia has huge crime rates and a give and get gun law. Seattle has a HUGE gang problem, with lots of gang related deaths, very few of them from legally obtained guns.
Simply put: that's a huge statement with little evidence backing it either way.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Wed Jun 22 21:55:05 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Christophe said:
>The discussion is not about the average citizen. I'm talking about terrorists legally owning and carrying weapons untill they decide to act on it.
>
Really ?
Since when does a terrorist care about the legalities of such things ?



 
addi Posted: Wed Jun 22 21:59:49 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:

>I would like a fair response to this because your being unfair now.


I did respond, hiffer. My post on buying a gun in Georgia. Maybe you missed it.

Unless you're certifiably nutso and/or a convicted felon (longer than one year prison term) it's fairly simple to buy any type of gun sold on the market, and that's a hell of a lot of different types of guns, from Beretta handguns to UZI submachine guns and everything in between.



 
ifihadahif Posted: Thu Jun 23 06:54:02 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  addi said:
>ifihadahif said:
>
>>I would like a fair response to this because your being unfair now.
>
>
>I did respond, hiffer. My post on buying a gun in Georgia. Maybe you missed it.
>
>Unless you're certifiably nutso and/or a convicted felon (longer than one year prison term) it's fairly simple to buy any type of gun sold on the market, and that's a hell of a lot of different types of guns, from Beretta handguns to UZI submachine guns and everything in between.
>
If you go to a gun show in Georgia and walk out with a full auto Uzi I'll kiss your ass, cuz that just ain't gonna happen. Yes, you can buy any gun sold on the market LEGALLY at those gun shows. Beretta handguns are legal and semi-auto Uzi's are too.
Of course these types of weapons are obtainable, and so is getting a pound of heroin, but you wouldn't say that it is "freely available" here now would you ?


 
FN Posted: Thu Jun 23 07:02:28 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  So if there's no point to gun control why is drug control an important thing


 
addi Posted: Thu Jun 23 07:21:23 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:

>If you go to a gun show in Georgia and walk out with a full auto Uzi I'll kiss your ass,

Could we make it something else? Nothing personal, but I don't want you anywhere near my ass.

And we've been through this before..it doesn't take a rocket scientist to change one into a fully automatic after it's purchased. I found detailed instructions on how to change a semi into a fully automatic in 15 minutes using a paperclip.

>Of course these types of weapons are obtainable, and so is getting a pound of heroin, but you wouldn't say that it is "freely available" here now would you ?

huh?
I have never said they were free, but if you want one you can find one...and that makes them freely available...unless there's a different definition of available in KY.


 
addi Posted: Thu Jun 23 07:35:28 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Each year roughly 4,500 gun shows are held in the United States, yet there
is no federal law requiring background checks for private sales of guns.
Texas leads the list with 486 gun shows annually, and, as with many other
states, has no state law requiring background checks for people buying guns
from unlicensed dealers. This loophole has made gun shows the second leading
source of illegal firearms recovered in gun-trafficking investigations,
according to federal law enforcement.

On September 10, 2001, a federal court in Michigan convicted Ali Boumelhem, a known member of the terrorist group Hezbollah, on weapons charges. He is currently serving prison time for attempting to smuggle guns to Lebanon. An undercover federal agent watched Boumelhem buy one of the guns -- an M-16 -- at a Michigan gun show without undergoing a background check.

Muhammad Asrar, an illegal Pakistani immigrant living in Texas, is also in prison on weapons charges. He has admitted that he illegally bought firearms at Texas gun shows without undergoing a background check. He remains under investigation by a federal grand jury on suspicion of involvement with al-Qaeda. Asrar had obtained a pilots license, had looked into renting a Lear jet and had obtained photographs of skyscrapers in U.S. cities. The government has revealed substantial evidence that Asrar was planning terrorist activity.

In Florida, Conor Claxton, an admitted member of the Irish Republican Army, is currently serving a prison term for attempting to smuggle to Ireland guns bought in part at Florida gun shows.

It is now clear that foreign terrorists have taken advantage of the loophole in our laws that allow individuals to purchase firearms at gun shows with no ID, no background check and no questions asked.
__________________________________

"Freely available" to honest US citizens....and international terrorists. They catch a few of them after the fact. You can imagine how many get away with it.
And, SURPRISE!...guess who throws a major stink anytime a politician tries to do something about this?
The NRA
(fucking hypocrites)

You cool with this, hif, or if the government tries to close this loophole is it just another case of the liberals trying to take away your second amendmant rights?


 
Mesh Posted: Thu Jun 23 07:46:59 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  At least we should all be able to agree on one thing. Nothing turns you on like staring down the barrel of a rifle being aimed at you by a curly haired irish lass dressed in frilly late 18th century dress with a feather in her hat, smoking a cigarette.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Thu Jun 23 08:28:57 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  addi said:

>"Freely available" to honest US citizens....and international terrorists. They catch a few of them after the fact. You can imagine how many get away with it.
>And, SURPRISE!...guess who throws a major stink anytime a politician tries to do something about this?
>The NRA
>(fucking hypocrites)
>
>You cool with this, hif, or if the government tries to close this loophole is it just another case of the liberals trying to take away your second amendmant rights?
>
I don't have a problem with forcing a background check, but I don't have a problem with anyone being able to purchase an M16 semi auto.



 
ifihadahif Posted: Thu Jun 23 08:31:23 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  addi said:
>ifihadahif said:
>
>And we've been through this before..it doesn't take a rocket scientist to change one into a fully automatic after it's purchased. I found detailed instructions on how to change a semi into a fully automatic in 15 minutes using a paperclip.
>
Which semi auto was this procedure performed on ? Does it apply to all semi autos ?
How do you know it's not bogus ?

See below:

SEMI-AUTOMATICS & SO-CALLED "ASSAULT WEAPONS"

* In a deliberate effort to have public policy made by deception, anti- gunners invented the "assault weapon" issue, noting that the public could not readily distinguish full-auto firearms _ sharply restricted by federal law since 1934 _ from semi-auto firearms. No legally-owned full auto firearm has ever been used in a violent crime by a civilian. Semi-autos are very difficult to convert to full auto and such conversion is a federal felony. Semi-autos which are "easy to convert" are not approved by the BATF for sale to the public.

* Data from states and big cities show that military look-alikes constitute 0-3% of guns used in crime and constitute only 1.5% of guns seized by police. Rifles, including semi-autos, are involved in only 3% of homicides.

* BATF traces tell nothing about the types of guns used by criminals, since only 1% of guns used in violent crimes are traced, and even that 1% is not randomly selected.(Congressional Research Service)

* Anti-gunners' hypocrisy: Claiming that handguns are not protected by the Second Amendment because they have no militia purpose, they support banning rifles and shotguns which do. Their ultimate goal is total gun prohibition.

NOTABLE GUN LAW FAILURES Since enacting a virtual handgun ban in 1976, Washington, D.C.'s murder rate has risen 200%, with a 300% rise in handgun-related homicide, as handgun use went from less than 60% of killings to 83%. No gun law in any city, state or nation has ever reduced violent crime, or slowed its rate of growth, compared to similar jurisdictions. With less than 3% of the U.S. population, New York City annually accounts for more than one-eighth of the nation's handgun- related homicides. Since it became a felony to go outside the city to evade its virtual handgun ban, the homicide rate in N.Y.C has risen three times faster than the rest of the country's. Gun rationing schemes have failed miserably. In 1975, South Carolina limited handgun sales to individuals to one per month. Since then, South Carolina's violent crime rate has skyrocketed over 100%.




 
addi Posted: Thu Jun 23 09:52:04 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:

>Which semi auto was this procedure performed on ? Does it apply to all semi autos ?

I don't recall, but what fucking difference does it make? It was purchased as a semi automatic rifle and it was easily converted into a fully automatic.


>How do you know it's not bogus ?

since I haven't picked one up and tried it for myself i can't say with certainty it isn't bogus.
However common sense tells me that since there were a number of sites saying the same thing that's it's logical to assume the proceedure works. Also that it was put up by a pro gun owner. If he put up misleading information some gun weilding loony would no doubt find him and shoot his sorry ass : )

editorial:
I understand I'm not going to change anyone's mind about guns here, especially yours. I also understand that if I could magically pass a law making it illegal for a citizen to own a gun that it wouldn't solve our gun problem. I'm not a head in the clouds liberal. Like Prohibition created in the '20's it would only create a black market for guns and end up taking away firearms from law-abiding citizens, and keep them in the hands of criminals.
I do think stronger gun control laws would lessen the amount of gun related deaths in America, but it wouldn't eliminate the crisis.

This is where I get pessimistic...
America breeds a culture of violence. It is part of who we are and we can't escape it. There are many factors involved in our high gun related death figures, including socio-economic differences, drugs, break down of family, culture of independance, and so on...that in my opinion will never change.

ifihadahif said:
>They say it's a real rush getting to shoot a 50cal full auto mutherfucker.

As a general stereotype Americans celebrate guns. More than anything else they represent the icons that were an essential tool in the founding and in the westward expansion of our country. Americans also worship power, and nothing gives a "real" man that testosterone rush feeling like holding a gun. Buffalo Bill was a man's man here, not Ghandi. You can't undo over 200 years of this deeply ingrained mentality by passing a piece of government legislation.

As ugly as it sounds, and as much as we'd like to deny it, males have a taste for blood...we get a thrill from causing death, and the instant supreme power it gives us. Guns are the ultimate source for that unmatched feeling of power..that (false) feeling of invincibility.

Guns and easy gun availability will always go hand in hand with the 4th of July, Mom, apple pie, and true patriotism here.



 
jennemmer Posted: Thu Jun 23 10:44:58 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  My opinion:

Nobody needs a semi-automatic weapon in their home. Hand-guns, though I am not a fan, I can understand to a certain degree.

That said I feel that having one around instantly escalates a situation. Something that starts out as an argument is more likely to become deadly if people are not in their right mind and there is a gun around as opposed to there not being one.

The lack of guns doesn't decrease the number of violent incidences but it does increase the chances of surviving one.

With a gun it is a lot easier to kill many indiscriminatly. In any other way you have to actually get close to your victim and without one you can't take out a room in seconds. (okay... barring even bigger things which _are_ illegal)

Now for a true story:
Not that far from where I live two guys in their 20s were at a party and got themselves right drunk and got in an argument. The situation escallated to the point where each grabbed a decorative knife off the wall and a knife fight ensued. It ended with one guy being stabbed in the leg and the other in the shoulder by the time the cops showed up. The story is now about two idiots who are now in custody because they realised it was better to go to the hospital than run. If there were guns involved what are the chances that at least one of them (if not also a bystander considering their state) would be dead as a result?


 
jennemmer Posted: Thu Jun 23 10:46:33 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Now in the words of a local comedy music group:

Arrogant Worms Lyrics
Let There Be Guns

One, two, three, four...

Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun'
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun'
There'd be no more crime, 'cause everybody'd have a gun!
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun'

Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun'
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun'
We wouldn't need the police no more, 'cause everybody'd have a gun!
(yeah!)
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun'

Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun' (had a gun)
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun' (had a gun)
Nobody'd ever get shot, 'cause everybody'd have a gun! (makes sense!)
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun'

We could go out and shoot things
We could go out and shoot things
We could go out and shoot things
We could go out and shoot things
We could go out and shoot things
We could go out and shoot things
We'd all feel safe, 'cause everybody'd have a gun!

Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun' (had a gun)
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun' (had a gun)
Everyone'd be equal, 'cause everybody'd have a gun!
Not me, I got me a rifle!
Well hang on, if you got yourself a rifle then I wanna get me a semi-automatic weapon!
You get a semi-automatic weapon and I'm gonna want an automatic weapon!
You get yourself an automatic weapon, I'm gonna get a super-automatic weapon!
Well if you get a super-automatic weapon, then I'm gonna get a
Super-duper-automatic weapon with a cd-rom drive!
If you get yourself one of those I'm gonna get a
Super-duper-automatic weapon with a cd-rom drive, and a big old hard
Drive, and a big guitar amp so I can play btos...
(rants on while the rest of the worms sing)

Wouldn't it be great if everybody had the weapon of their choice'
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had the weapon of their choice'
Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun'

(still ranting..)
I'll go so fast I'll be able to chase you from here to saigon, and
Then I'll shoot like little nerf rockets at you and poke you in the
Eye 'cause it'll have automatic like finger-poking in the eye
Things and I'll get myself another guitar amp...



 
addi Posted: Thu Jun 23 10:52:26 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  LOL!
Good song, Jenn


 
ifihadahif Posted: Thu Jun 23 11:18:47 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  addi said:
>ifihadahif said:
>
>>Which semi auto was this procedure performed on ? Does it apply to all semi autos ?
>
>I don't recall, but what fucking difference does it make? It was purchased as a semi automatic rifle and it was easily converted into a fully automatic.
>
Because easily convertible semi autos are not legal to own or sell.

>editorial:
>I understand I'm not going to change anyone's mind about guns here, especially yours. I also understand that if I could magically pass a law making it illegal for a citizen to own a gun that it wouldn't solve our gun problem. I'm not a head in the clouds liberal. Like Prohibition created in the '20's it would only create a black market for guns and end up taking away firearms from law-abiding citizens, and keep them in the hands of criminals.
>I do think stronger gun control laws would lessen the amount of gun related deaths in America, but it wouldn't eliminate the crisis.
>
How do you reconcile the stats concerning the concealed carry laws ? That being that where they exist, gun crimes are way down.

>This is where I get pessimistic...
>America breeds a culture of violence. It is part of who we are and we can't escape it. There are many factors involved in our high gun related death figures, including socio-economic differences, drugs, break down of family, culture of independance, and so on...that in my opinion will never change.
>
You might want to consider these facts in your opinion:

Gun laws and firearms availability are unrelated to homicide or suicide rates. Most states bordering Canada have homicide rates similar to their northern neighbors, despite much higher rates of firearms availability. While the American homicide rate is higher than most European nations, and firearms are frequently involved in American homicides, America's violent crime rates are even higher for crimes where guns are less often (robbery) or infrequently (rape) involved. The difference is violence, not firearms, and America's system of revolving door justice.

* England now has twice as many homicides with firearms as it did before adopting its repressive laws, yet its politicians have responded to rising crime by further restricting rifles and shotguns. During the past dozen years, handgun-related robbery has risen 200% in Britain, five times as fast as the rise in the U.S.


>ifihadahif said:
>>They say it's a real rush getting to shoot a 50cal full auto mutherfucker.
>
>As a general stereotype Americans celebrate guns. More than anything else they represent the icons that were an essential tool in the founding and in the westward expansion of our country. Americans also worship power, and nothing gives a "real" man that testosterone rush feeling like holding a gun. Buffalo Bill was a man's man here, not Ghandi. You can't undo over 200 years of this deeply ingrained mentality by passing a piece of government legislation.
>
Hey, Americans don't have exclusivity where the macho is concerned. Where do you think the term "macho" came from originally ?
Why do American action movies do just as well overseas as they do at home ?
One of the things that is great about our country is that we can celebrate Ghandi and Jesus as well as Buffalo Bill. We are not the bloodthirsty culture you claim we are, certainly no more than other "civilized" countries.



 
beetlebum Posted: Thu Jun 23 11:21:11 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>addi said:
>>ifihadahif said:

>NOTABLE GUN LAW FAILURES Since enacting a virtual handgun ban in 1976, Washington, D.C.'s murder rate has risen 200%, with a 300% rise in handgun-related homicide, as handgun use went from less than 60% of killings to 83%. No gun law in any city, state or nation has ever reduced violent crime, or slowed its rate of growth, compared to similar jurisdictions. With less than 3% of the U.S. population, New York City annually accounts for more than one-eighth of the nation's handgun- related homicides. Since it became a felony to go outside the city to evade its virtual handgun ban, the homicide rate in N.Y.C has risen three times faster than the rest of the country's. Gun rationing schemes have failed miserably. In 1975, South Carolina limited handgun sales to individuals to one per month. Since then, South Carolina's violent crime rate has skyrocketed over 100%.


Let me guess, you got this from the NRA website. What a shitty source with a lot of spin. The NRA can prove no correlation between less enforcement and increased crime. In addition, perhaps, if there is a link, the correlation between higher crime rates and strict gun laws has to do with the fact that increasing crime rates *incurred* tougher legislation.

Also, the NRA is full of shit.
http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/sccrime.htm

Sure, violent crime, in number of crimes per year per 100000 persons doubled by 1995. BUT WAIT. Crime then FELL after 1995 per 100000, AND in 1995, the right to carry law was sent to SC's Congres DIDN'T pass, and crime is STILL FALLINGl! This indicates that restricting guns had nothing to do with the increase in crime. The NRA was still lobbying SC Congress this year to get a right-to-carry law passed and crime is still falling.

To go off topic: some statisticians/economists propose that "Perhaps the most dramatic effect of legalized abortion, however, and one that would take years to reveal itself, was its impact on crime. In the early 1990s, just as the first cohort of children born after Roe v. Wade was hitting its late teen years-- the years during which young men enter their criminal prime-- the rate of crime began to fall. What this cohort was missing, of course, were the children who stood the greatest chance of becoming criminals. And the crime rate continued to fall as an entire generation came of age minus the children whose mothers had not wanted to bring a child into the world. Legalized abortion led to less unwantedness; unwantedness leads to high crime; legalized abortion, therefore, led to less crime." The book, Freakonomics, that I pulled this from, is fantastic. Properly crunched numbers don't lie, and these economists have nothing to gain from saying what they do. However, so much of they say screws with your brain.

Of course, in Hif's defense, they also point out that a child is 100 times more likely to drown in a swimming pool than he or she is to be killed by a gun. Our society feeds on fear; we just don't fear the right things. The mundane is actually more dangerous than that which we see as "harmful," like guns. Part of that has to do with our media, which doesn't report the local child drowning, but will report if he or she fires a gun at him or herself, or another child. Information regulation.

Honestly, no one can convince me that assault guns are a good idea, but I can see why people want the right to buy them. Frankly, though, like Hif said, there should be much heavier regulation. Hell, we regulate everything, why not guns? I wish the NRA didn't have such a throat-hold on our government and wasn't so full of shit.

In any case, this post was allll over the place. What I mean to say is:

Hif, I adore you (I really do!) but don't quote an NRA pamphlet. That's just insulting to my intelligence.

Guns are not cool, but we can't get rid of them, so let's regulate them more and better. Look, if you really love them, you should be willing to wait a month.

Addi, our country isn't falling apart. My road trip last summer for five weeks showed me how good people really are in this country. The NEWS portrays a violent culture, and Atlanta probably has some of the worst violence, so you must feel surrounded by it. But really, most people are pretty good people and the ones that aren't are usually found out. We have a million problems to fix, but so does every other country on earth.

Pools are dangerous! Watch your kids around them (but don't leave a gun about, either.)

This is my last post for the summer. The sweet feeling of satisfaction knowing that unless you respond quickly, I'm going to have had the last word. ;o)


 
addi Posted: Thu Jun 23 11:37:07 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Nice to hear from you Beetlebum..wish you would find a way to stay around.

having said that...
I never once said our country is falling apart. I expect to have hif put words in my mouth ("we are not a bloodthirsty culture"), but not you : )

I pointed out some serious issues America has, but that's a far cry from saying we're falling apart.




 
beetlebum Posted: Thu Jun 23 11:56:39 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  addi said:
>Nice to hear from you Beetlebum..wish you would find a way to stay around.
>
>having said that...
>I never once said our country is falling apart. I expect to have hif put words in my mouth ("we are not a bloodthirsty culture"), but not you : )
>
>I pointed out some serious issues America has, but that's a far cry from saying we're falling apart.
>
>

Sorry. I think that whenever I respond to you, you assume that I like to paraphrase what you said. I just meant that you shouldn't be so pessimistic. It is your kind heart that leaves you vulnerable, but you should look around sometimes and remember that America doesn't breed a culture of violence. Stupidity, maybe, but not violence. :o)


 
addi Posted: Thu Jun 23 12:28:48 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  beetlebum said:

>I just meant that you shouldn't be so pessimistic. It is your kind heart that leaves you vulnerable, but you should look around sometimes and remember that America doesn't breed a culture of violence. Stupidity, maybe, but not violence. :o)

: )
No hard feelings here. Hugs




 
FN Posted: Thu Jun 23 12:32:24 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  beetlebum said:
>This is my last post for the summer. The sweet feeling of satisfaction knowing that unless you respond quickly, I'm going to have had the last word. ;o)

where are you going? :o(

*sobs*


 
ifihadahif Posted: Thu Jun 23 13:21:03 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  beetlebum said:
>This is my last post for the summer. The sweet feeling of satisfaction knowing that unless you respond quickly, I'm going to have had the last word. ;o)
>
Dammit, why do you keep leaving ?
Just know this, when you aren't here, you are missed.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Thu Jun 23 13:22:42 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  heh heh heh heh, she adores me . . .
:-)


 
FN Posted: Thu Jun 23 15:38:21 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  She adores me more.

I make her randy baby, yeah.

If you agree Beetlebum, do not respond to this before the end of summer.


 
Silentmind Posted: Fri Jun 24 00:25:09 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Wow, this got big in a hurry. So, my two {well, 1 point something american} cents. Any time you have a picture of a gatling gun on a website, proclaiming you can fire that thing to your hearts content, disturbs me. Someone owns that thing. And if the event is that large, theres bound to be some wackos. And I'm sorry, putting an automatic weapon in any civilian's hands is crazy. What is the use? An automatic weapon to go hunting. What? Are the deer and birds going to stampede and swoop and then kill you? Home protection? Give me a fucking break. You wouldn't be able to hide it anywhere convient. If you were so bloody adament about protecting your home, get a pistol. More accurate, and it can be hidden. Lug it around the streets to prove you are the most macho guy on the street? My, what a large bulge you have in your pants. Still, there is no need for a person to own a gun for hunting or home protection.

Actually, I'd be happy if you used bows and arrows to hunt and protect your home. The natives did just fine hunting, and it'd freak the hell out of a bugler if you shot him with an arrow. Oh, and there wouldn't be any of those cleaning mishaps, or oops I dropped the gun and it went off and shot a kid in the face. I swear, the saftey was on and the chamber was empty.


 
Mesh Posted: Fri Jun 24 05:15:09 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  You mean, you guys dont think its a good idea for heavy machine guns to be in the hands of guys like these?

http://www.collegehumor.com/?movie_id=160812


 
addi Posted: Fri Jun 24 06:49:57 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  meshuggah said:
>You mean, you guys dont think its a good idea for heavy machine guns to be in the hands of guys like these?

"if you're gonna be dumb...ya gotta be tough"

*and I wouldn't even trust those guys with kite string


 
Mesh Posted: Fri Jun 24 06:53:52 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  addi said:
>
>*and I wouldn't even trust those guys with kite string


Yeah, someone would end up getting decapitated. Seriously.


 
ifihadahif Posted: Fri Jun 24 06:57:10 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Silentmind said:
>Wow, this got big in a hurry. So, my two {well, 1 point something american} cents. Any time you have a picture of a gatling gun on a website, proclaiming you can fire that thing to your hearts content, disturbs me. Someone owns that thing. And if the event is that large, theres bound to be some wackos. And I'm sorry, putting an automatic weapon in any civilian's hands is crazy. What is the use? An automatic weapon to go hunting. What? Are the deer and birds going to stampede and swoop and then kill you? Home protection? Give me a fucking break. You wouldn't be able to hide it anywhere convient. If you were so bloody adament about protecting your home, get a pistol. More accurate, and it can be hidden. Lug it around the streets to prove you are the most macho guy on the street? My, what a large bulge you have in your pants. Still, there is no need for a person to own a gun for hunting or home protection.
>
>Actually, I'd be happy if you used bows and arrows to hunt and protect your home. The natives did just fine hunting, and it'd freak the hell out of a bugler if you shot him with an arrow. Oh, and there wouldn't be any of those cleaning mishaps, or oops I dropped the gun and it went off and shot a kid in the face. I swear, the saftey was on and the chamber was empty.
>
Maybe you should pay more attention to the website.
In the history of the Knob Creek machine gun shoot, there has never been a "mishap", it's well organized and safety is paramount.
As for the gattling gun, of course someone owns it. And he has never killed anybody or anything with it.
Does he "need" it ? No of course not.
Does he want it ? Yes.
Does he have the right to own it ?
Yes
Silentmind, you confuse the need to own something with the right to own something.
Who gets to decide what you need and what you want ? Who is in charge of that ? Who would you trust to make those decisions for you and your family ?


 
addi Posted: Fri Jun 24 07:29:22 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Do I want it?
Yes

Do I need it?
Yes

Do I have the right to get it?
Yes

Have I ever had a "mishap"?
no comment

: )


 
Silentmind Posted: Fri Jun 24 12:06:19 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>Silentmind said:
>>Wow, this got big in a hurry. So, my two {well, 1 point something american} cents. Any time you have a picture of a gatling gun on a website, proclaiming you can fire that thing to your hearts content, disturbs me. Someone owns that thing. And if the event is that large, theres bound to be some wackos. And I'm sorry, putting an automatic weapon in any civilian's hands is crazy. What is the use? An automatic weapon to go hunting. What? Are the deer and birds going to stampede and swoop and then kill you? Home protection? Give me a fucking break. You wouldn't be able to hide it anywhere convient. If you were so bloody adament about protecting your home, get a pistol. More accurate, and it can be hidden. Lug it around the streets to prove you are the most macho guy on the street? My, what a large bulge you have in your pants. Still, there is no need for a person to own a gun for hunting or home protection.
>>
>>Actually, I'd be happy if you used bows and arrows to hunt and protect your home. The natives did just fine hunting, and it'd freak the hell out of a bugler if you shot him with an arrow. Oh, and there wouldn't be any of those cleaning mishaps, or oops I dropped the gun and it went off and shot a kid in the face. I swear, the saftey was on and the chamber was empty.
>>
>Maybe you should pay more attention to the website.
>In the history of the Knob Creek machine gun shoot, there has never been a "mishap", it's well organized and safety is paramount.
>As for the gattling gun, of course someone owns it. And he has never killed anybody or anything with it.
>Does he "need" it ? No of course not.
>Does he want it ? Yes.
>Does he have the right to own it ?
>Yes
>Silentmind, you confuse the need to own something with the right to own something.
>Who gets to decide what you need and what you want ? Who is in charge of that ? Who would you trust to make those decisions for you and your family ?


I wasn't saying there was a mishap at the actual gun shoot, I was making reference to when you go home. Yes, we don't /need/ everything we own, but come on, a gattling gun? An automatic at home, just in case. And with the whole "right to own it thing": Get a muzzle loader, like your forefathers intended, sit out on your front porch, and wait for the brits to invade.


 
choke Posted: Sun Jun 26 04:13:33 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I haven't read any more than 2 lines in anyones posts because I'm not really interested, but my uncle shot himself in the foot the other day :D


 
addi Posted: Sun Jun 26 07:27:26 2005 Post | Quote in Reply  
  choke said:
>but my uncle shot himself in the foot the other day :D

I've done that several times here with some of my posts
(figuratively speaking of course for you literalists out there)


*hope he's okay


 



[ Reply to this thread ] [ Start new thread ]